Tuesday With Mike | The Divine Selfie – The Story of the Jesus Shroud of Turin

➡ The Untold History Channel hosted a discussion about the Shroud of Turin, a historical artifact that has intrigued many, including the host, Mike King. Mike, who was raised Catholic, decided to write a book about the Shroud after being moved by the forensic data surrounding it. The book, titled “The Divine Selfie: A Crash Course on the Jesus Shroud of Turin”, aims to present the facts about the Shroud for readers to form their own conclusions. The Shroud, which is only displayed every few years, appears as an impressionistic image of a man, but when photographed in negative, reveals a clearer image.
➡ The text discusses the historical existence of Jesus Christ, supported by records from Roman historians Josephus and Tacitus. It also talks about the political unrest in Judea during Roman rule, leading to the crucifixion of Jesus. The text then shifts to the Shroud of Turin, believed to be Jesus’ burial cloth, detailing its journey from Judea to Constantinople, then France, and finally Turin. The Shroud’s authenticity remains unconfirmed by the Catholic Church, but it has been revered by the faithful for centuries.
➡ The text discusses the mystery of an image on a linen cloth, believed to be the Shroud of Turin. The image, which appears to be a negative, becomes clear when photographed and developed, revealing a detailed image of a man. Despite skepticism and accusations of fraud, the image was confirmed by multiple photographers over the years. The image also has 3D properties and shows signs of wounds consistent with the crucifixion of Jesus, leading many to believe it’s authentic.
➡ The article discusses the Shroud of Turin, a cloth believed to have covered Jesus after his crucifixion. It details the forensic evidence found on the shroud, such as whip marks, a helmet of thorns, and a spear wound, all consistent with the biblical account of Jesus’ death. The article also mentions a chemical found in the blood on the shroud, indicating the person was tortured. However, carbon dating in 1988 suggested the shroud was from the Middle Ages, not 2000 years ago, leading many to believe it’s a fake. But in 2000, two enthusiasts suggested the tested piece of the shroud may have been from a repair done in the 1530s, casting doubt on the carbon dating results.
➡ The Shroud of Turin, initially debunked as a medieval fake, has been re-examined and found to be around 2000 years old. This was discovered after a court order forced the release of original data from the 1988 study, which was found to be flawed. The Shroud has traces of pollen unique to Palestine, Turkey, and Western Europe, matching its historical journey. Other evidence includes the presence of Roman coins on the eyelids and limestone identical to that found in Jerusalem, further supporting its authenticity.
➡ The text discusses the Shroud of Turin, a religious artifact that has survived multiple fires and is believed to have been imprinted with an image through an intense burst of light. The author suggests that this light could be related to the resurrection of Christ, transforming his body into a glorified state. The text also mentions a potential conspiracy involving the United Nations and globalists to destroy the shroud. Lastly, it talks about a filmmaker who became a Christian after trying to debunk the shroud’s authenticity.
➡ A man named Lee Strobel, who was once an atheist, became a Christian after investigating the Turin Shroud, a religious artifact. He offered a million-dollar reward to anyone who could duplicate the Shroud, but no one has been able to do so. Another man, Barry Schwartz, despite initially being uninterested due to his Jewish faith, became a believer in the Shroud’s authenticity after studying it. Despite skepticism and even hatred towards the Shroud, these men and others continue to defend its authenticity.
➡ The speaker discusses a claim that Leon Trotsky converted to Christianity in Mexico, which they plan to research further. They also talk about a potential spiritual revival in the world, referencing the Shroud of Turin and its potential as a tool for evangelism. They express hope for the Shroud to be re-examined with modern technology, believing that it could strengthen faith. The speaker also mentions their book, which they believe could have a powerful impact on people’s hearts and minds.
➡ The speaker plans to share a document with their mother and friends, confident that it’s well-done and free of errors. They discuss a minor mistake in the presentation, not the document, and express satisfaction with the overall work. The conversation ends on a positive note, with plans to meet again next Tuesday.

Everybody, welcome to the Untold History Channel. My name is Ron Partain and it is Thursday, which is. We were supposed to do this on Tuesday, but Mike had some technical issues at his end. I guess they imported the California governor over there and they did a brown out or something on him. I don’t know. Well, it was a little bit hairy. The house was smoking. Oh, really? Yeah, they were gonna have. And evidently was too much of a surge coming in. Blew out some of the surge protectors, shut everything off and the power company handled it.

I didn’t have to get a local electrician, but that’s kind of, that’s kind of spooky. Well, good, good thing we’re home. Yeah. You know, to shut everything off. But yeah, alarms going off and that’s kind of spooky. Yeah, I’m glad, I’m glad, I’m glad you still have a house to record in. I, I, I think Satan got pissed off after. He’s always after me. Yeah, that’s funny. Well, so. Oh, I had, I got the book and I left it in my room, so. Damn it. I, oh, well, I have, I have a copy here and you’ve got the PDF I sent you, so.

Yeah, but I just wanted to show the book off, so. But I can’t. It’s, it is here. I do have it. I just don’t have it here with me, so. But anyway, before we dive in here, tell me a little, tell us a little bit about, you know, kind of what, how, how, where did this project come from? Because this is like, this isn’t really standard Mike King. This is kind of a little off the wall for you. Yeah, definitely a change of pace. I mean, it is a, his historical artifact, but my, my historical specialty is really the last 250 years.

I only dabble in some of the old stuff, but it was some time ago, actually was. A reader asked me to take a look at it, see what I think. Of course, I’ve heard of the Shroud of Toran. I was raised Catholic, but there was never in the Catholic Church. There’s never really a definitive position. It’s not part of any catechism. They just kind of leave it out there for the, the faithful to believe or not to believe. But it’s a holy artifact. But I took a dive into it and just what I learned about the forensics of this amazing artifact.

So it intrigued me and I, I guess I felt the Holy Spirit move me. I gotta, I gotta write this book. You know, it’s not like an evangelical endeavor it’s not religious in any way. I’m just dealing with the receipts of the amazing forensic data. Right. Coming from scientists, secular scientists can’t explain this. And it really is remarkable in two respects. The data itself is astonishing. We’ll get into that. But even more so the fact that this is kind of not known or very little known, even suppressed within Christianity and within Catholicism itself. I mean it’s out there, everybody’s heard about it, but they don’t really get into the meat and potatoes of it.

And when you do, that’s when the mind is blown. So I, you know how to look at it and I’m just presenting the facts. People make their own conclusions from it. But these are undeniable facts that we’re going to get into tonight. Right. You know, I never asked you this and I don’t mean if it’s too personal then you feel, don’t feel free not to, to say, I’ll decline. But are, what’s your heritage? Are you like Irish? Irish Italian. Mostly Italian. Okay. All Catholic, you know, through the Catholic, did the sacraments, the communion, confession and like I said, I, I went to, to the Catholic schools and was taught none of this.

Well, that’s not, that’s not a surprise. Yeah, so there’s somebody, you know, maybe the Catholic Church doesn’t want to bet all their chips on this and then it turns out to be fraudulent. But nonetheless the forensics should be known, should be standard in my view. Right. Because it’s really mind boggling stuff. Well, you know, it’s, it’s, and I don’t wanna, this, I don’t want to go down this rabbit hole too much, but I, I wanted to say because, because I think there are similarities to you know, like information with the Catholic Church and how it’s released and whatnot.

And you know, I mean I, I look back and it’s my opinion that one of the, probably the biggest transforming invention in human history would have been the, the Gutenberg Press. And when the Gutenberg Press came out, I mean you had like almost 70 to 70 years of just really unsettling in Europe because there was a lot of people who broke away from the Catholic Church because they started reading the Bible for themselves as opposed to just listening to what the Catholic Church had to say. And I feel like The Gutenberg Press 2.0 is the Internet.

So. And I mean, I mean, and you know, all the information that we’ve been taught over the last, you know, 150, 250 years, it’s been Lies. So, so, you know, and again, I’m not. That’s not an indictment on Catholic Church. I’m just trying to draw. I’m just trying to draw a parallel there. So. But in any event, let’s, let’s jump into the book. I’m kind of eager. I purposefully have not looked at it because I want to be. I want to be. I want it to be novel for me as you talk about it. So. Okay, so let’s, let’s do this here.

So there it is, the divine selfie, A crash course on the Jesus Shroud of Turin. It’s available out of Amazon. You can find it under my author page, which is Mike King or Mike S. King, not Michael. And many of my other books there, paperback or Kindle format. It’s also available@realnewsandhistory.com but as always, if there’s a book of mine, that’s. That Amazon will carry. It’s preferred to get it there, write a review, push it up the algorithms. This way other people can stumble across it. And I, I did put the link to the book in the description.

Okay, excellent. So. And it’s, I don’t know, an hour, hour 15. Read lots of pictures that I’m doing more of these types of works late. I call them my crash course series. Right. The smaller books, this, the, the, the, the hour to pick it up and look through it in an hour type thing. Yeah. They tend to have a broader appeal. People are pressed for time. They just want to get to the, the meat of the issue. And so there it is. So that’s, that’s the image, and we’re going to get into this. But if you go to Turin when the Shroud is on display, that’s not what you’re going to see.

The Shroud of Turin has the appearance almost like an impressionistic sponge painting. You don’t see a discernible image. You know, it’s the outline of a man, but it almost looks like an amateurish artwork. You only see that image right there when you take a negative. Really? Yeah. And, and we’ll get into when the first photograph of the Shroud was taken. And, and from that moment on, it really became a, a very mysterious object. But that is not the Shroud. That is a negative of the Shroud. And we’re going to explain. Gotcha. All right, well, you tell me when to.

You tell me how to move, because I’m gonna, I’m gonna follow. I’ll just say next. Next panel. Okay, go ahead. Okay. So the, the Top image, that rectangle, that small rectangle, that’s, that’s the shroud is, it’s more or less 14ft long by 3ft wide. So the body would lay on the shroud and then the other half would be folded over the head so it’s covering your front and your, and your back. And then beneath that, you see the side by side impressions on the shroud. This is what you would actually see in torrent when it’s on display.

I, I, they only display it every few years. So clearly you see the image of a man, his hands folded, but it’s, it’s not all that clear. You see what I mean? It’s, it’s kind of like impressionistic. Right. Okay, so let’s go to the next panel. All right, now, what does the, the Good Book say about the linens and shrouds and cloths associated with Jesus and in his burial? From the book of John, four gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, it says Simon Peter came along and went straight into the tomb. He saw the linen clothes lying there as well as the cloth that had been wrapped around Jesus’s head.

The cloth was still lying in its place separate from the linen. Two cloths, a big linen cloth, and then something that goes around the head. We’ll talk about that later as well. Luke says Peter, however, got up and ran to the tomb, bending over, he saw the linen cloths lying by themselves. So you’ve got multiple cloths corroborated by the Gospel writers. So that’s kind of like the context with which we attempt to interpret the Shroud of Turin. Okay, next panel. And I thought I should just briefly mention Jesus in secular history. I mean, you’ve got some naysayers out there.

They’re, they’re very few, but they say, oh, there’s no proof he ever even existed. Well, Jesus Christ, as the historical personage demand, absolutely did exist. Yes. So it’s not just the gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John that record his existence in secular Roman history. There’s Josephus, who’s a Jewish Roman historian. Yep. Not much. It was Jesus Christ. He was crucified under the reign of Pontius Pilate, spawned the movement. Doesn’t get into anything religious, anything like that. And then Tacitus, the official historian of the Roman Empire and a Roman senator. And you know, these weren’t exact contemporaries of Jesus.

They’re writing like 40 years after the fact. Right. Confirm his existence and crucifixion in Judea under the governor punches Pilate. These are serious scholars. They’re not going to his traffic rumor. I mean, of course he existed because let’s just say for devil’s advocate, you were going to invent. I mean, you still have to have somebody to base it on you person, not a whole old cloth. So he absolutely existed. And so let’s get that out of the way. Well, there are, there are historians who did write about, about Christ, so that, that, you know, not from, not from the Bible, but you know, from, from writings from that period.

So it’s, it’s. Yeah, he absolutely existed. Right. So that’s not even a question of faith. And another thing we, we know from history or that we can infer. Well, actually, we know, we know that the province of Judea was always a big problem for the Romans. They were always rebelling, always stirring up the usual suspects. You know, nothing’s changed. Nothing’s changed. And at once, at one time, the Romans even had special coins minted for that region because they said, oh, we can’t have Caesar on, on the coin. You know, that’s like, okay. They’re always trying to pacify them.

And then there was like a violent sect. They were known as the Zealots. That’s where the word zealot zealotry comes from. Really? Yeah, the Jewish sect always rebelling. That’s what Hanukkah is about. Rebellion of the Zealots against the Greeks. So it’s big, big problems. And all the Romans wanted is order. They wanted their taxes and obey the laws. That’s it. They don’t care about your local religion or your culture, your language, whatever. Okay. But because they were so unruly, they had to appease them from time to time. Finally, in the year 666 A.D. they said, screw that.

Titus, Titus came in and wiped them out, Busted up Jerusalem, scattered them to the winds, sacked the city. And that’s what the Arch of Titus in Rome is all about. And you even see this carved into it. You see a depiction of Roman soldiers carrying out menorah and everything. So they, they really got sick of it 30 years after Jesus. Well, and that was what. And, and, and that was one of the big writings of, of Josephus was the Jew the Jewish war, you know, 80. I think it was 80. Was it 6066. 67 to about A.D.

70, when the, when the temple was destroyed. So yeah, so that’s real. And we also know if we just back up a second, that from the accounts in the New, the New Testament, that Jesus was also a fighter. So it’s not just peace Love, type of. No. Yeah. The stories of him throwing at the. Throwing all the money changers out of the temple. Yeah. He fashioned the whip, which implies premeditated anger. You. He didn’t just grab a whip. He fashioned it. He says, I’m gonna get these MFers. Okay. And then just in the New Testament, you’re hypocrites, you sons of the devil.

Okay. So now, just through inference, we can piece together what happened, and it’s really corroborated by the New Testament. He took it to the Pharisees, and naturally, they would go to Pontius Pilate and say, we got to get this guy out. That’s the Israeli lobby of the day. They did a Gaddafi on him, a Hitler on him. Exactly. It’s. Nothing changes. Okay, so. So we pretty much know that story. At the behest of the Jewish elders, Jesus was condemned to horrible death, which the Romans would not have done on their own. It’s just an appeasement because again, they don’t.

They don’t care about that. That stuff. Right. As long as you pay your taxes, obey the law, and don’t cause trouble, they don’t care about the religious matters. Yeah. Next panel. All right, those are scenes from Mel Gibson’s movie. And when we get into the Shroud and the forensics of it, that movie was no exaggeration. I mean, as horrible as it was to watch, that’s. That’s exactly how they took it to him. They. They really brutalized them with spiked whips and crowned them with thorns and crucified him, all at the behest of the. The Pharisees. Yep.

That was. I’ve only ever been able to watch that movie one time. Yeah, I, I just. I, That’s. I, I just. Yeah. Okay, so now we have a little bit of context that most people already know, but it’s a good little review. Let’s talk about the historical journey of the Shroud. It was stored in Constantinople was passed down generation and generation by the early Christians. And that’s at a time where I suppose if you were caught with a relic like this, it was death. Because the early Christians were persecuted for the first few hundred years until Rome adopted Christianity’s official state religion.

And the West Roman Catholic Church in the east, the Orthodox Church, kind of like sister churches. Right. The Knights Templar got a hold of it from Constantinople. So it seemed like there was one of the Crusades was actually Christian on Christian. Typically, they went and they tried to push back the Muslims. And, you know, the Crusades were not these expansionist imperialist things that the left, fake historians teach. No, it was centuries of encroachment from, like, the Moors and the Turks. This is the Europe pushing back, trying to reclaim what’s stolen from them. Because this was all part of the Western world at one point.

Syria, Palestine, North Africa, so on. But anyway, it was during the Crusades that Knights Templar brought it back to France. They brought it to France, circa 15. Oh, that’s. That’s a typo. I transposed the number 1350. It’s bright. To France and is kept in a. A church in France. And the Pope at that time, Pope Clement, was skeptical. He declared that it was a relic, but he didn’t take a position on his authenticity. And that’s pretty much been the position of the Catholic Church all along. They don’t tell you what to think about it. So that’s the journey, the oral history.

Judea, modern day Palestine, Turkey, Constantinople, which was the capital of the Roman Empire. The eastern half. Now it’s Istanbul, Turkey. Okay. And then it ended up in France. Okay, next panel. Now, nearly two centuries later, in 1532, a fire nearly destroys the Shroud. Very bad fire. The cathedral caught fire. I don’t think these things are accidental because if you, if you study Satanism, which is really a topic I didn’t really get into until Q came along, I always knew there were weirdos who practiced that, but now I am convinced that it’s something at elite levels that passes down century to century.

I agree. Yeah. And this was a horrible fire. And the. The Shroud was kept in a case and it had, like, metal around the rims actually started melting. And you. You see the marks on it to this day. So it. And the cloth itself might have even caught fire, but they managed to get it out. So it was very, very nearly destroyed in 1532. And there’s an old medieval image of some bishops or cardinals holding the Shroud lengthwise. And it’s head to head. You see the back of the body in the front of the body because it’s folded, folded over.

So that’s 1532. Next panel. Six years later, the. The house of Savoy, who were the kings of France, which at that time the. The kingdom encompassed northern Italy as well. They moved it to Turin, the Cathedral of St. John the Baptist, where it is to this day. And that’s where it takes its name from. It’s the. The Shroud of Turin. But it was once the Shroud of Constantinople, then the Shroud of France, but now it’s the Shroud of Turin. And it’s been there ever since. 500 years now. So all of these centuries dating back from the very beginning, 2,000 years ago.

This is passed down generation to generation and revered as the. Amongst the faithful, as the burial cloth of Jesus Christ. But now subsequent generations, they have. The only thing they have to go on is faith, really. It’s not until 1898 that you begin to this. This was the first bit of evidence in his favor. You could call it forensic evidence, actually. A photographer who’s actually an attorney and an amateur photographer. Photography is what, 40, 50 years old at this time. Okay. He is granted the privilege of being able to take the first ever photograph of the Shroud of Turin.

And we’ve seen what the Shroud looks like, that impressionistic, almost abstract image of. Of a man, but no discernible images. Well, Segundo Pio takes, Takes the photo, and you see there in a museum there, that’s his original camera, and that’s the image that shows up on his glass. And because, as you know, back then, before the age of instant photos with iPhones, right, it took a picture and then you took the little roll out of your camera, the, the negative, you brought it to cvs, you pick it up a few days later, you’re all excited to see your color photos.

Of course, it wasn’t like that back then. You had a negative wasn’t even filled, right? The image and a plate of glass, and you went in the dark room, you develop and you convert the negative to a positive image. So here’s what Pio says. I’ll let him explain. He said, closed in my dark room, all intent on my work, I experienced a very strong emotion when during the development, I saw for the first time the holy face appear on the plate with such clarity that I was dumbfounded by it. No human being could have painted this negative that lies hidden in the stains.

It was not painted and not made by human hands. So in other words, the image on the linen is the negative. So when you take a negative of a negative, he comes up with this positive. And you see this perfect image of a man, and everything is discernible. The nose, the lips, the beard, the wounds. So he later said, he almost dropped. He dropped the plate, almost. He was like so shocked with what he saw, because he’s expecting to see something even more unclear, expecting to see a negative of that impressionistic image, but instead he gets that image there.

Okay, so here’s what I mean. We remember these negatives. I. I guess the, the 35 or the 30 and undercrowd will look at that and say, what’s that? 35 millimeter? Yeah, but that’s what your camera produces a negative. What the cameras used to produce. Okay, for example, like that image of the little girl. You look at her face, you can’t tell anything. It’s, it’s a negative. But then they develop it in the dark room, they have certain chemicals, etc. And then you get the crystal clear, perfect replica of reality there, the picture of the little girl.

Now look at the, the two Jesus pictures just below the first one is the shroud. It looks just like the little girl. That vague kind of outline, that’s a negative. And then the, the negative of the negative, look what it yielded. Look, look at the definition. The brow, the nose, the, the mustache, the beard, the blood stains. And in the body, the, the thing, the fingers, the wounds. Anatomically perfect. So that is a negative image on the shroud yielding a, a positive. How is that possible? There was no photography 2000 years ago. Right? How does the artist know what he’s doing? Is he making a.

So called artwork and thinking to himself, you know, I’m, I’m really clever because 2000 years from now they’re going to invent photography and then they’ll see my image. No, of course, of course not. Now the naysayers at the time, I mean, this was all over the Italian newspapers of 1898. People believed them. But then you had the critics and they say, here’s the skeptic saying this, this guy’s a fraudster. He pulled a fast one. They didn’t believe it. And it was not for an additional 33 years, not until 1931, that another photographer was permitted to take pictures.

Giuseppe Henri. And by this time the photography is even more sophisticated. And lo and behold, he yields the same exact results. Those are his images there. There’s the whole body shot. And there’s the third image, which is actually the COVID of my book. At the same results, you see this perfect image of a man from a linen which you can’t even see what the image is. So. And Segundo Peele was still alive at this time and Henri had invited him to the event, some sort of press conference. And he was vindicated because he lived with this little stigma for the last 33 years.

Did he pull some kind of scam? No. So that’s quite a mystery. No one can explain this. This is photographic imagery. There’s just no doubt about it. It’s a negative. What are the, what are these images like the, those blotches, those lines. Yeah, yeah, that’s, that’s from the, the fire of 1532 began to melt the casing. So that’s like molten metal was dripping all over it. Gotcha. Okay, so it, it was, it was damaged, but it survived. So that’s how close it came to. They’re being incinerated forever in 1532. Interesting. Okay, so here we are again.

Now there’s a full body shot. There’s the shroud. All the properties of a negative that you would get from your, your film. Next to it is the negative of the negative which you’re not supposed to see, which is so shocked. Segundo Pio. And in the third image, the image actually has 3D properties. I suppose you need some special mechanism to be able to detect that. But you can see the 3D properties of the image. So you can determine like depth and so on. So it’s more than just like a photo. It’s almost like a scan, a CAT scan.

Super sophisticated. You know, one thing that I notice here is on this image is this blotch right here. Yeah. And then on here it’s obviously the reverse. Right. And I’m wondering, is that the, is that the wound? Because, because the nails. Yeah. From the nail, as I understand it, you know, the, the modern. Everybody thinks it was in his hands. They didn’t do it into the hand. There wasn’t enough, there wasn’t enough like meat and muscle and bone to hold you up. They actually, where they did it was they did it into the wrist. That’s right here.

And that looks very close to where it would have been. Like if it is in there in the wrist. Yeah. Now that’s what I got. There’s two bones here. And what’s interesting, if you like really squeeze on this hard, like you’ll see your thumb involuntarily tuck in. Imagine what a nail would do. And indeed, on the image, his thumbs are not visible because locked in. And then your rigor mortar sets in. So his thumb, his thumbs are locked in the image. You know, no artist is going to think of that. Okay. And it’s anatomically perfect images.

Nobody could even sketch like that until Leonardo came along. Okay, Right. So that’s where we stood for the longest time now. So now you’ve got the 2000 year oral history and deep faith that it’s authentic. Then you have the Segundo pio photos in 1898 and then additional photos in 1931. It’s not until 1978 that we get more advanced technology to have a. To have a look at this artifact. In 76, a pair of scientists began assembling a team. John Jackson and Eric Jumper and 30 other experts from various fields formed the Shroud of Turin Research Product Project.

STIRP for short. So they got. They got physicists, they got experts on chemistry and experts on fabric experts and blood and radiology. Everything you think all these various fields, all these science scientists, forensic scientists, and most of them, they actually did a poll just to kind of see where people’s minds were. Of the STIRP team before. And as you might expect, most of them are atheists or agnostics. There were some Jews, there were some Catholic. There were only two people on the team who believed this to be authentic. And the rest were either skeptical or they thought it’s.

We’re gonna find out the truth. So that’s, that’s where their minds are. But they were professionals, and everything about this project is just the facts, just forensic data. They did not have any kind of agenda. However, they did feel almost to a man that going in that they were going to be the ones to finally crack this mystery of how they did it. So the team was purely scientific. What they found profoundly surprised them. All right, here we go. Okay, so they, they did things like capture samples from the shroud. Everything from blood to the fabric to the pollen.

They used adhesive tape. They captured 32 samples. And when they arrived, these are the main conclusions, the main points of the STIR project, which they announced at the end. Number one, there are no paint, oil, or scorch marks anywhere on the Shroud, the source of the image, which only affects the tippy top microns of the fibers. Remains of unknown origin. No paint, no stain, no scorch, no, no artist. Number two, nothing was drawn by strokes nor by dotted art techniques. That’s not where the image comes from. So they totally ruled out artistry. Number three, the human blood stains are real, and it’s the very rare type AB positive.

Only 3% of men have a B positive blood. Number four, the pattern of the blood stains is consistent with those of a man who’s crowned with thorns and flogged mercilessly. He see all the wounds. Wow. Okay, I’m gonna, I’m gonna show you later on what that looked like, but they could detect all the whip marks. And actually, they say it wasn’t a crown of thorns. It was more like a helmet of thorns. It wasn’t just the perimeter. They’re jamming them on top of the head. Two men carried Out. The flogging with spiked wh whips would have little pieces of metal or bone at the end to really tear into your flesh.

And they were even able to determine that one man was taller than the other guy from the angle of the whip marks. Wow. Number five, some of the blood which stained the shroud had previously bled out onto the body from a still living man. As he’s being whipped, as he’s being nailed, he’s alive. Now that blood’s coming up. That’s live blood. But some of the other blood oozed out after death. Obviously at the moment of death, the properties of your blood change. The blood’s no longer being oxygenated, for example. Right. So they, they could tell the heart’s not pumping and there’s no blood.

There’s, there’s no oxygen coming in from the lungs and they could detect that. So it’s both. That blood came from man was living, who later died and continued to ooze. Number six. The properties of the blood samples reveal the presence of a trauma induced chemical known as bilirubin. Rubin. Secreted from the liver. It’s indicative of someone who had been tortured and terrorized. Similar in some respects to adrenochrome. Right. I mean, when you’re under extreme stress and you’re tortured, terrorized, your body’s pump, that’s in your blood. That’s why you’re feeling that reaction. So, so this man was tortured and it’s in the blood.

Number eight. Hey, what happened to number seven? Oh, that’s okay. The blood, the blood stained the fabric first. The superficial image of a tortured man happened afterwards. So he’s laid out on a cloth, he’s all bloody. But this event that the, the, this that was able to capture his image happens afterwards. And they can tell because there’s areas where there’s blood. There’s no, no image on top of the blood stains. It doesn’t take on blood stains, it takes on the linen, non blood stains. So the, the blood came first, then the image. Number nine, there is an image of a spear wound on the side of the body.

Wow. Completely consistent with the gospel accounts. Got a big stab mark right here. And that’s, and that’s postmortem blood that’ll oozed out because he’s dead already. The gospels say he was stabbed in the side with a spear. The Romans wanted to make sure he was dead before they pulled him down. Of course, this is all forensics. This is, it’s not theoretical science that’s supported by Rigged math equations or computer models, nothing like that. These are just the facts. This is the essence of science. Forensic science, experimental science. None of these points are disputed. They can’t be disputed.

That’s why these guys, their minds were blown. That’s a 1978 stirrup. That gentleman there in the first image, that Dr. John Heller, he delivers the final word on Stirp. I have a lengthy excerpt from his amazing statement. It’s in the book the Divine Selfie here. But he. He states, quote, we can conclude for now that the Shroud image is that of a real human form, of a scourged, crucified man. It is not the product of an artist. That’s a fact. Okay, the other image there, that’s Alvin Adler. He was the expert on blood chemistry, and he confirmed, and it’s since been reconfirmed, that the blood on the shroud was indeed that of a man who had been tortured and released.

Bilirubin. Now, what you’re seeing in this image, I mean, there’s the. There’s the negative, which is a positive. Yep. And. And from that, a mannequin was made which depicts the wounds based off of what you can see on the shroud in terms of what’s visible as far as the wounds go, and also from the blood marks. So that’s, that’s, that’s just making it clearer. So you see there, he was nailed in the wrist between two bones. Because you put it in your palm, it’s gonna. You’re probably rip. Okay, so it’s in the right place. His knees are badly scraped.

That’s consistent with the gospel accounts. He kept falling down with that heavy cross. You see the spear wound on the side. You see the blood flowing from the head. The crown of thorns. And so that’s exactly how it is. So it’s not like a. An imagination type thing. This is from the shroud. Perfectly matches the accounts, the New Testament, and makes you realize that Mel Gibson wasn’t exaggerating in. In that flick. He stayed pretty true, right? To. To what actually happened. Based on. Based on the Shroud, real blood. Now 1988 comes along. Carbon dating debunks the Shroud.

Oh, isn’t that a shame. I remember when my mother heard this on the news. She was so disappointed. Trying to console her. Well, don’t worry about it. It’s still a miracle. How did. How did the image get on there? But this was big. Was all over the news that night. Big news. He only had the three networks, all of them, Dan Rather, everybody. This was One of their lead stories, the Shroud is fake. New York Times, Washington Post, all over. So what, what happened is the, the, the Vatican allowed a new team of scientists to test the Shroud with a relatively new procedure known as the carbon 14 dating.

They tested the Shroud and it came back. You see the date range there on the blackboard, 1260-1390. And these scientists were so proud of themselves. You know, they even put an exclamation point after the 1390. You see, it’s, it’s fake. So there’s a headline, New York Times torrent, Shroud shown to be a fake. There’s the three scientists from three different laboratories posing in front of the British Museum. This study was undertaken under the auspices of the British Museum. They’re all proud of themselves. And, and what they did is, I mean, obviously the church had to allow them to cut a little sample from the cloth or this.

They’re gracious enough to do that. They did. And they did their tests and they leaked it to the press. That’s a real dick move. They didn’t go to the church. Right. They just went behind their back, leaked it to the press. So that kind of puts the Church in like a corner. He had done it privately. They could say, well, how did, what was your methodology? We want to have some other people take a look at it. Second. Yeah, let’s get a second opinion. Yeah, yeah. But they out maneuver them so the hype came first and then the Church just went along with it.

And you know, once the Vatican declared it’s not 2000 years old, it was game over. And this was very demoralizing for the faithful. Major black pill, the carbon 14 dating. And you’ll see in the next page, trust us, because we say so. Right? Yeah, but it was a double whammy because the church went along with it, you see. Well, yeah, so, but at that, but by that point the church had been compromised. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. There’s infiltrators in the shirt. It’s partially that, partially cowardice because now if we question it, we’ll, we’ll look like we’re in denial.

And you know, also at, at this time, I, I think it’s a little bit different of a culture in the 80s. I mean today this stuff wouldn’t fly so easily because we’re, we’re, I mean a lot of normies still worship fake science, of course, but I, I think a lot more people are awake. Right. If they were back then, people would have said, well, you know, wait a minute, let’s have another look at this. Can we? Are you sure? But there the New York Times Church says the Shroud is not authentic. Now look at all these headlines.

They’re gleeful. Fake news, fake accompli turn. Shroud was the work of a medieval master forger. Huge, like I said, a huge black pill. And the legend of the Shroud seemed dead forever. So that the. The Church’s new position was. Well, we still don’t know how this image got on the cloth. That could still be a miracle. But it’s not 2,000 years old. So that’s it. Shroud is dead. Or is it now in the year 2000. And what I’m going to describe to you actually transpires over nearly 20 years. But it started in the year 2000. The 1988 debunk is itself debunked, or so says this.

This, this couple right here, that’s Susan Benford and Joseph Marino. They’re Shroud enthusiasts. Shroud promoters. Okay, but they’re not scientists. Susan Benford is a. Is a nurse and I think Marino has some kind of technical background. But they’re not actual scientists. But what she noticed just from pictures of, of the pieces of the Shroud that were tested. She looked at it closely and she theorized it doesn’t quite match. There’s all anomalies. What if this was part of the repair work that was done in 1530s after the fire? And that’s known history that there were some. The nuns, the seams.

They were like some amazing seamstresses. Did repair work on the Shroud that you could not even tell if it was the original or not. But she could with her keen eye. Now the problem is no one’s going to listen to these people. They’re not scientists. Right. However, one of the ST team members, his name was Barry Schwartz, Jewish guy. Isn’t this ironic? Kind of made it his. His life’s work to promote the Shroud. He was so moved by it. Had a website and everything. Lecture circuit books. Tireless advocate in favor of the Shroud’s authenticity. They presented it to Bernie Schwarz in the early 2000s.

Bernie Schwarz puts it on his website and then he contacts that gentleman on the far right there. That’s. He’s another STURP scientist. The original STURP members, Ray Rogers. And Ray Rogers doesn’t believe it. He basically, he says to Barry, these people aren’t scientists. You know, they gotta let it go. This is nonsense. They’re saying it, it’s not the right cloth. Etc. But he said, I’ll take a look at it. He still had samples from 78. So he put that under the microscope and then he looked closely at the images. He said, holy crap. It’s. It’s a different weave or a different fabric.

It doesn’t look the same. So now the 1988 debunking is now in question. The Shroud is back in play. However, they needed to get at the original data from the 1988. They wouldn’t release it. The British Museum had it. Oh, what a shot. For years. Yeah, they, they won’t release it. Just like they just, just like they won’t release the. Was it the, the, the Pike Mazzini letter? Oh, no, we don’t have it. It doesn’t exist. Yeah, lots of stuff they won’t release. They don’t release the dinosaur bones. Those are. They don’t release the, the climate change.

That. Right. Indicator. Because with, with true science, that’s the first thing you want to do is throw it open to the public. Hey, everybody, have at it. Peer review. Check our work. Yep. That’s the whole point. Yep. What are you hiding? So what happens next? Finally, a court order in Britain. Just like here they have foia Freedom of Information Act. The FOIA request was filed and it took the force of British law finally say, release that data. And indeed they did. And what they found is the methodology was so, so bad that it had to be deliberate.

Of course it was deliberate. That’s why they didn’t want to release it. What these sons of bitches did, Ron, is in violation of all scientific methods and protocols. Instead of doing, like, multiple samples from different parts of the Shroud, they keyed in on one area of the Shroud, took one sample, it just happened to be from where the repair work was done. Took that one sample, cut it in three, sent it out to three different laboratories to create the illusion and independent corroboration from multiple sources. And they all come back, dating it to medieval times. It’s a fake.

That’s what they did, those sons of. And since that time, new, more advanced and more accurate procedures than even carbon 14 have been developed. In the second image, you see Dr. Julio Fonti, he dated the Shroud using a technique known as spectometry. And guess what? Comes out to 2000 years old, give or take. Nobody disputes it. And it was later repeated. The shroud is indeed 2000 years old. Problem is, the 1988 hype job is still in people’s heads. And a lot of people to this day will say, oh, no, don’t you remember they. They dated it.

It’s only 800 years old. So that they heavily publicized. But the debunk of the debunk, you know, back pages in a paper. But that’s the truth. It’s 2, 000 years old after all. And Marino wrote a book the 1988 C14 Dating of the Shroud of Turin. A stunning expose when he get. He gets into all the fraud. It’s not bad science. It was fraudulent. They did it on purpose. Of course they did it on purpose. That was their intention all along. That’s why they went around the church’s back and still telling the church. They went to the press.

Okay. That’s why they fought it in the court. Took 19 years. So this is relatively recent now that the shroud has been redated. So everything’s back in play. Now you’ve got Stirp and now you’ve got the right date. So the shroud has been resurrected. No pun intended. What an expert. Next panel here. So it did get some mention in the news. Very little. Nothing like the 1988. But that’s the Express of London. Jesus Christ. Bombshell. The Shroud of Turin hoax claims are ruled out. But isn’t the face of God? The Shroud of Turin could hold the real face.

Jesus Christ. Etc. I’m just going to read this expert excerpt from the bottom. July 2019. A new paper published in the Oxford University journal ARC has challenged the validity of the methods used in the original study. In 1988, dating was done on small snippets of the shroud taken from the edges of the cloth. In the new study, however, researchers argue the method was flawed because it did not analyze the shroud as a whole. The new study followed a successful lawsuit to gain access to original data collected in 1988. And then came the. The spectometry. So. So it did get some press, but not as much as.

As. As it should have. That’s not a surprise. Next panel. Now there are other proofs, forensic proofs of age and origin. It’s, it’s. Imagine it’s. It’s amazing what these forensics can turn up. So like what’s that TV show? Csi? Yeah, probably csi. I. I don’t know. I don’t watch television. So they found on the shroud pollen. Now pollen gets into everything. If you’ve never known anyone with pollen allergies, how much they suffer during pollen season or you see it all over your car. Pollen gets everywhere. There’s so many thousands of species of plants. Most plants are Indigenous to a certain area of the world.

They found on the Shroud pollen that is unique to Palestine, also known as the shitty little state these days, but I prefer to call it Palestine or Judea of the day. And the pollen doesn’t lie. This shroud was in Jerusalem at one time. And then it also shows that there’s pollen unique to Turkey and Western Europe. So the, the pollen matches the oral history of the Shroud. Jerusalem, Constantinople, France to Italy. It’s, it’s almost like fingerprints. Next panel. They were, they’re able to detect the presence of Roman coins on the eyelids. And then they brought in a new numismatic expert, coin collecting expert, saying that those coins appear to be from the Judea in that time period.

This was physicists John Jackson and Eric Jumper, who are also original STURP members. They were the original organizers. They detected the presence of Roman coins holding down the eyelids. Interesting. Very interesting. I did, I, I, I didn’t. It is that putting coins over the eyes, was that a, was that a practice in that day? I think it’s been a practice even like in, in more recent times. I, I think, I don’t think it’s like anything to do with ritual. I think it’s just to keep the eyes shut because I think involuntarily they hope they open up again.

So, next panel. Limestone match on the Shroud. Again, this is a spectrometric analysis, the same that they use for dating Dr. Giulio Fonti on the Shroud. It revealed trace remnants of limestone. They’re on the nose, the knee, the heel. Again, this is consistent with the Gospel accounts. Jesus keeps falling down, falling on his face. From that he’s been whipped, he’s tired. The cross is heavy and it’s, it’s a limestone trail. The dirt is from a rare limestone identical to that found in Jerusalem to this day. Wow, that’s very interesting. Yeah, I mean, everything is just perfect.

This is something nobody would even think about. Now remember when we, I read those quotes from Luke and John about the, the, the, the linens in the tomb was the lemon, there was the linen and there was a cloth around the head. His face would have been so badly bloodied and bruised. It’s just out of respect, they put a linen, it’s called a sudarium around his head, take him to the tomb, so you don’t see them all mangled up like that. And in the tomb they removed the sudarium. And there it is in the Gospel accounts, the cloth that was wrapped around his head.

And then there’s the linen which is the shroud, this, the sudarium and the shroud went on diverging paths. Okay. So somehow the sudarium ends up in Spain. It was probably in Constantinople as well at one time, ends up in Spain. King Alfonso has it preserved in a gold plated arc like that. So this is the cloth that was used to cover the head of Jesus. It’s covered in blood is what’s interesting. The blood patterns, the bleeding patterns on the sudarium ovieto match the shroud perfectly. The head wounds and I think like over 30 head wounds and facial wounds match up.

Okay. Furthermore, when the blood was tested, it also came up AB positive. Perfect match with the shroud. That’s only 3% of men. 3% times 3%. Okay. And the pollen again, Palestine. So those are the two garments they got separated. Only this doesn’t have an image on it, just has the blood. Why? Because it was removed. They would, they would have removed it prior to laying him out on the slide. Did they test the blood on this? Did it match the blood? Was the D. Did they do DNA? DNA? No. I don’t know if they had DNA capability like that to extract it from a little bit of blood back in 1978.

But they do know the blood type. But that’s why we need to get back in there because I think now I’m sure they could because, you know, just people speculate, he’s not going to have the DNA of an earthly father, he’ll just have his mother’s DNA. Let’s see, that would be, wouldn’t that be amazing? Ah, but this is, this is, that was, that’s the facial covering. So for the blood type to match like that, the blood pattern, the pollen. So yeah, this is real too. It doesn’t have an image because remember what I said, the blood comes first, then the image and the blood was.

And, and the blood here also, like you said, was the rarest blood type of all men, by the way. 3%. 1977, another fire. Bad. All cathedrals in Italy. This, this one here gets torched. St. John, containing the Shroud of Turin. And this was a horrific fire. It was saved by heroic firemen. Went in there and he had his mates just dousing the area with water. They couldn’t contain the fire, they figured just keep the area cool. He was banging away through bulletproof glass and metal, the sledgehammer. For 15 minutes people were lining the streets, touring around the cathedral, crying.

And finally he emerges with the shroud, became an instant rock star. His name is Mario Tr. He Was later declared hero of Italy. He saved the Shroud. But more significantly now is, is this is not accidental either. Is there Satanic Masonic plot to burn the Shroud? Indeed there is. And I’m going to present some interesting data here in support of that next panel. It just so happened that in that complex there’s an adjoining hall connected to the cathedral and there was an event taking place there. United Nations. They were honoring Kofi Annan. And this is the demonic, satanic New World Order United nations we’re talking about.

Right? Kofi Annan. And in this area, in this hall, which is not right where the Shroud is, but it’s adjoining, it’s the same building. They’re having cocktails, coffee and On Andriotti, Prime Minister of Italy. Globalist. The guy from Fiat, what’s his name? Oh, I forget his name. Fiat, Big globalist. You know, Fiat later merged with Chrysler under Obama. So all these characters are there with their entourages and their security people, and then they leave. Is later determined by the Turin fire Department. They’re part of their investigation that while the event was wrapping up, the fire had already started.

Interesting coincidence, but they say, oh, there’s no connection. There’s no conspiracy. There was some work going on. Some people were careless. Just like the, just like Notre Dame. Notre Dame? Yep, yep, just like Notre Dame. That’s Emmanuel Macron’s deal. And remember, Michelle Obama’s right there drinking champagne. Yeah. On the river cruise as it’s burning. Yep. Satanists, you know, and you know, I, I was, I, I, I, I’ll talk about that here in a second. I’ll let you finish. Okay. This gentleman here is Victorio Masari. He is Pope John Paul’s official historiographer. And he was, he was very firm.

He, he was saying stuff that maybe the church felt they couldn’t say, but they used him as a front. And he was very strong, that this was some sort of plot. Satanic Masonic plot, Globalist New World Order. He didn’t say globalist New World Order, but that’s what it is. It was just too much going on. I mean, the UN is there and then the fire starts. But he writes, believe me, someone wanted to burn the Shroud. I do not exclude an international plot. And I would suspect Masonic circles, the usual suspects. So that’s twice that the Shroud has almost been destroyed and was saved heroically.

Almost like it’s God protected right now. In digging a little deeper, I learned that Tan is known as like a haven for Satanists, which would kind of make Sense, because you got the Shroud there. You, you would think that the Satanists would want to offset that type of divine positive energy with their own presence in the city. But touring is like their Italian capital, Satanism. That’s a headline there. This is before the fire, 1986. Does Satan lurk in Turin or just some amateurs? LA Times, 1990. Turin is getting a devil of a time. The city has a reputation as a haven for Satan and his disciples.

The Catholic Church has six exorcists on duty. So it’s just too perfect. You got the, the UN, the Satanists, etc. Well, you know, you know the, in the scriptures, it actually talks about like the, the sky, the stars in the sky and a. Certain, certain stars in, in, in. In a specific position. And they’ve analyzed that and they, they result. There’s only, they narrowed it down to. There was only like a one hour, a one hour window of, of when Christ’s birth occurred according to the scriptures. And that date would have been September 11th. That’s so.

Yeah. Yeah. Now think about this. And, and again, not, not trying to go down a rabbit hole, but what is the astrological sign of, of September 11th? Virgo. Virgo. Virgin. I love that. Yeah. Virgin. Okay, what’s, what’s the, what’s the sign? If you, if, if. So if you start with Virgo being the first sign and you go all the way to the last one, to the one just before Virgo, what is that? Leo. Leo. Leo. What is Leo? Lion, the king of the jungle. The king. The king, yeah. So there are many people who believe that the, that the, this, the, you know, the story of Christ is told of the stars.

So. But the point I was making there is that, you know, you talk about 9, 11, if it’s September 11th, is his birthday, birth, and, and how many really horrific events have occurred on that day. Yeah, yeah. Well, it would stand to reason. Yeah. That they would, they would want to parallel that and offset it. Right. So, so there it is. I mean, you would have had the manpower on the streets to get somebody to do it. But then you add to that the potential protective cover of UN bigwigs. You. Yeah, that, that was another Notre Dame job.

They wanted to get rid of the shroud. Now ask the question of what could have caused that image. Again, John Jackson of Sturp, he’s older now, but he’s still investigating. And Paolo Delazaro of the Frati Research center in Rome. They posit that intense UV light would have caused that. The image and a light so Intense. I think they calculated it out to like, I don’t know how many gazillions of watts, but it’s something that even the most powerful sophisticated lasers can’t even approach today. Okay. And yet without heat. Because the amount of heat associated with such an intense light would disintegrate the shroud in an instant.

But it didn’t. So that’s. That’s the theory. Intense light, some say it was radiating from within him. Some say it’s external. I mean, these are all speculations. But one thing that is clear, only an intense light of unimaginable proportions could. Could have taken that selfie. Okay, another speculation here. On to the. The light and what happened. It’s not speculation that an intense light caused the image. Not in my book. But as to where it came from, you know, that’s. We don’t know yet. But Father Robert J. Spitzer, president of Gonzaga University from 1998 to 2009, he’s also a scientific background.

He writes the known laws of physics cannot explain how a decaying human body could admit such an intense burst of vacuum, ultraviolet radiation, or how a body could become transparent. This leads many to conclude that the image on the Shroud of Turin has a transphysical cause possibly tied to the resurrection of Christ. Jesus’s resurrection involved more than returning to life, his body transformed into a glorified transphysical state. The shroud may be evidence of this transformation captured through a miraculous burst of radiation. Interesting. These are plausible scenarios. Radiation from within the body, external light. But one thing that to me is not speculative is an intense light of origins that we can imagine made this image.

Now, here’s an easy million dollars. Anyone wants to go for it. David Rolfe, he’s a British filmmaker, was an atheist, and he was doing a documentary on the shroud. He wanted. He’s another one tried. Think he could debunk it. Now he’s a Christian. How about that? There’s a lot of cases of this sounds to me like. It sounds like a case of what’s the guy’s name from Chicago? And he was the. He. He wrote up. He wrote a book called he was. He was a guy. He. He did the. The legal section for the Chicago Tribune.

And he. His wife became a Christian and he went out to go to debunk it, and he went to all the. Talked to all these scientists and all this other stuff, and it turned out that he was like. He’s like, there’s no way in hell that this could be. That it could have happened. Just miraculous I mean, it just could have just miraculously happened without some sort of intelligent design. His name will come to me. Yeah. Now there’s, there’s a lot of such characters, but this Shroud in particular has triggered this in a number of people.

And this is very recent. It’s from the Guardian, April 17, 2022. The 1. Thank you. Oh, Lee Strobel. Thank you. Okay, Lee Strobel. Anyway, if the Turin Shroud is a forgery, show how it was done. And Rolf says, they said it was created by medieval fraudster. And I tell him, well, if he could do it, you should be able to do it too. And if you can, I’ve got a one million dollar reward for you. I encourage you to repeat this thing by creating something similar today because all of the evidence I have seen if it is a fake is the most ingenious fake in history so far.

Note takers. So he was an atheist that became a Christian as a result of the Shroud. Yeah. Right. And he’s got, he’s putting up a million dollars of his own money for people to duplicate it. Nobody took him up on it. They can’t. And you know, a million dollars, that would just be chump change because if you were able to duplicate this and, and fulfill the conditions of his challenge, the fake news would put, they would have put so much fame, okay, so much hype to your name that you imagine the book, the book deals, the lecture circuit.

Multi millionaire. If you could crack this code. But nobody did. Nobody will. They can’t. They absolutely can’t. Cannot be duplicated. Barry Schwartz. I wanted to mention Barry Schwartz for a number of reasons. First of all, he was the one kind of really inspired me because he’s. His videos are all over the Internet. He’s given lectures, podcasts. This became his lifelong passion. He’s an original member of the STURP team. He was a medical, scientific, photography expert. That’s why he was invited by one of the st physicists who knew him, had done work for him. And he said, I’m not interested.

I’m Jewish. This is Catholic stuff. But it’s not for me. You have to be persuaded. And ultimately he felt, well, I’m going to get a free trip to Italy out of the deal. We’ll go there, we’ll find the paint or the stain, we’ll crack the mystery. Come on. Instead, he comes out basically evangelized. I mean, he’s not converted to Christianity or anything, but he’s a total believer in the authenticity of the Shroud. And he’s so juiced up about it when he talks about it. There he is in 1978. But he, more than anybody, I think, is, is in the modern time, has schooled more people on some of these facts that I’m presenting to you today.

And I was going to reach out to him for an interview for this book and possibly the right to forward. I come to find out he recently passed away a few months later. Months ago. Okay. But he also deserves credit for, for, in many ways, for resurrecting the shroud. Because remember when I talked earlier about Susan Benford, she thought something was off with the, with the fabric. Nobody would have taken her seriously. But she knew Barry Schwartz because he’s a shroud activist, in a sense, and he was able to act as a conduit and put it into the STIR pipeline and get it to Roy Ray Rogers, who then came back and now with scientific authority.

There’s an important lesson here, too, because this, the, the humble woman here, the, the lowly nurse who’s not a scientist, she had it right. Okay. Ray Rogers didn’t believe her. But then Ray Rogers came along, so now it had the, the official approval of forensic science behind it. And from that came the process to get the Freedom of Information act and to get the 1988 information and debunk the debunk. But he was the point man on this. Wow. Without him, people would have just said, you know, Susan Benford, she’s crazy. Right? So isn’t it, isn’t, isn’t that interesting? A Jew shaves the shroud.

I know. I was just thinking the same thing. It inspires, Inspires me. The author of the Bad War. That’s how that works. Yeah. I, hey, when I think of him, I, I, you know, Benjamin Friedman? Oh, yeah, yeah, that’s right. He was another one. That’s right. Yep. So I tell you what, once you convert one of them, they become bulldogs. Oh, yeah. On your side, you know, so. Well, you know, it’s, it’s when, when you, when you, when you shake the, the, the, the, the lies and you see things and you analyze them for what they really are.

You know, a lot of these, A lot, a lot of my. I, I have a friend who’s just, I mean, she, all she sees is racism and Trump’s horrible and all this other stuff, and it’s like, you know, you know, I don’t believe that she’s ever really given him an honest chance. She’s just, you know, she listens to MSNBC too much or CNN or whatever. It is. And it’s just, you know, if anybody took the, took the time to actually be intellectually honest and analyze it without a, without a preconceived bias, you will come to the conclusion that some of these guys have.

Right. And I, and I mean that’s across the board. That’s not just about this particular topic. Yeah, that’s true. So I, this is from the final section of my book. I talk about the hateful bias against the shroud. And I quote from Matthew where Jesus says, you will be hated because of me. And indeed this shroud is hated. Now I’m not talking about those who remain skeptical or don’t believe. Something deeper with a lot of these characters, they really hate this idea. What would motivate these so called scientists from 1988 to fudge the forensics of it? That’s pretty deep.

Okay, give us the real date test, take the proper random samples and give us the real date. You want to believe in it, fine. But to, to manipulate data like that, there’s something deep going on and there’s, there’s a lot of hatred for this artifact. You got the fire in 1532, you got the fire in 1997. There it is, just as just a small example. That’s the amazing Randy. James Randy. He’s dead now, but he was a magician. But his, his shtick was to like debunk like supernatural con artists and stuff. And a lot of his stuff was actually solid.

But he’s also a, was a radical atheist, outspoken atheist. Just hated religion, God, Christianity, all that stuff. And he talks about the shroud. He was, he was interned. He says, I was in Italy when the fabulous shroud of torrent was again being displayed to the eagerly gullible. Well, why would you go there? You know, just to start trouble. This huge rag, so thoroughly and authoritatively discredited by experts. That’s a lie. Was guarded by garishly custom volunteers, glowered at me, perhaps because I resembled the ran. A rabbi. But you know, you could just feel like the hatred and the animosity coming out of them for, for this.

Yeah. And that kind of explains why this thing remains buried. It should be a big, a constant, big news story. You think there would be big teams of scientists assembled. Now this here wraps it all up. Image on the far left, that’s the shrouded Torah. And that’s what it looks like again. You really can’t discern any kind of image. It looks amateurish, impressionistic. Then you take a negative and it comes to life and that handsome young fellow there, that is AI generated Jesus based on the shroud. Wow. Okay, so they, they cleaned them up, fixed his face up, took away some of the swelling, and obviously, you know, it would have been in bad shape, but just from the general bone structure, this is what AI makes him look like.

It looks like Jim Caviezel. Yeah. Impressive. Yeah. All right, so there it is. The divine selfie is only like 14 bucks. Those of you of faith, this will strengthen it, protect it, whatever. Those of you are still skeptical. Remember, I’m not preaching any religion or faith to anybody. You make your own decision. It’s just like my presentation here tonight. Everything I just presented is hard, indisputable data. Doing it what you will, you will. But nothing that I presented here tonight can be disputed. And indeed nobody has. You know what I wanted to, I was going to ask you earlier, Are you familiar with Kate Griggs? The name rings a bell, but no.

So apparently her husband was in like, he was a, like a special operator officer and operated in the Marines and was, was involved with all kinds of, you know, deep, dark, dirty stuff with, you know, you know, CIA and stuff like that. Anyway, she did an interview back in 1998. It was like 10 hours long. And somebody sent it to me. One of, one of my followers sent it to me, and I’ve watched a very good, good portion of it. Anyway, one of the things that she said in there that I found very interesting was that Leon Trotsky, when he got banished from, from Russia when, when Stalin obviously when Lenin died, there was a little bit of a struggle for, for power and Trotsky was banished and, and Stalin took over.

She made the claim that Trotsky actually converted to Christianity in Mexico. And I had never heard that. And I was curious if you had. I’ve never heard that. I, I’d have to see some receipts. I, I agree. I, I’m just, I, that’s. Well, and that’s. I, I didn’t do any research on it. It was just something that, that stump that came across my, my radar screen yesterday. Last night, as a matter of fact. So I haven’t really done any, any digging into that, but I just was curious in your, in your research history if you’d ever heard that.

So I’m, Yeah, I’m actually going to be. I, I found the 10 hour long video and I broke it up into like, basically roughly hour long parts and I’m gonna upload that in 10 parts for people to watch so that it’s a, it’s Digestible. Very interesting. And, and it makes a lot of sense when you think, you know, talk about some of the things and not, not really have anything to do with what you’re doing. But it just was with, with the topic of the show today, but just, you know, with things that are going on in our world.

Yeah. But anyway, that’s why I wanted to wait until the very end before I brought it up. I didn’t want to, I didn’t want to because it was way too off topic. So anyway, that this was, well, I’m, I’m glad that I didn’t look at the book before I listened to your presentation of it. This, it was, that was, that was really good. I felt like I, I felt like I’m a, I’m a, I’m a watcher of the show. No, that was, that was really, that was really interesting. I, I, I have to tell you, I’ve, you know, I’m, I’m not really, I wasn’t really familiar with the Shroud of Tur.

And I’ve heard, heard of it, but that’s, yeah, that’s to the extent of my understanding. Well, I’ll tell you what, on an optimistic note, I have a feeling this is going to become much more known and I’ll tell you why. Mel Gibson was on the Joe Rogan podcast a couple weeks ago. Yep. And he said next year he’s going to start filming the Resurrection. Right. With Jim Caviezel. And then he starts talking about the Shroud. It’s right about the time that I’m finishing this up. I said, wow, what timing. And he mentioned the Roman coins. I think he mentioned the pollen.

He mentioned that the, the, they redid, they redid the dating on it. So he’s talking about the Shroud in conjunction with this film. So I, I think as part of his movie, it’s going to touch on this or it’s going to become a topic. And then we come to find out Trump essentially naming Mel Gibson and Sylvester Stallone as. And John ambassadors and John Vo to make Hollywood great again. Yeah. So, and there’s no question that there is a spiritual Christian component to the Q operation. And so maybe ultimately, because, because really, Ron, all the political stuff, the economic stuff, that’s great.

We don’t have some kind of spiritual revival in this country. Well, it’s already happening. It kind of is. You see Trump spokeswoman. Yeah. She’s wearing. Could it get any bigger? I don’t know if you noticed. Yeah, I know. Yeah. You know, and, and you Know, I, There’s. I, I watched the Sean Ryan podcast a lot. You know, I, I really like a lot of the work that he’s done. And I mean, he’s like a hardcore outspoken Christian now. Yeah. And so many others are too. You know, Hegseth, when they, they were criticizing him because of his tattoo.

Right. You know, I mean, there’s, there’s just a lot. You know, I, I do absolutely believe we are on. On the upswing of a huge spiritual revival in this country and in the world and in the world in general. Yeah, yeah. It has to be because, you know, these things. You know, historically, when you have these cycles, I mean, we’ve gotten so bad right now, and it’s so unnatural. The pendulum swings one. It’s like the pendulum. It’s like the pendulum. And, and I, I have, I have said that, you know, the pendulum is either coming up to the apex, it’s either at the apex, or it’s hit the apex and is starting to come back.

Right now we are on the. We’re at that point where I don’t, I don’t know if it’s there yet, if it’s all. If it’s right there or if it started to come back. I don’t know. But it’s, but we’re at that. We’re as far as we’re gonna go to the, on, on the, Just the, the, the end of the stick. If I may, if I may be vulgar about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I’ll tell you what, Ron. This here is actually the most powerful tool of potential evangelism as well as protection of faith imaginable. Okay.

I mean, it has. Look what it did to David Roth, atheist filmmaker, sets out to debunk it. Instead, he’s offering a million dollars to anybody who thinks they can debunk it. Right. Barry Schwartz. That’s the power of it. Even as I’m working on this piece, putting it together, it’s just mind blowing in it. So it’s just amazing to me. Well, it’s not amazing. It’s understandable that the church and Christianity in general has not used this as like their lead punch, their strongest punch. Probably because they figure if we bet all our chips on this and science debunks it, we look like idiots.

But, you know, they don’t even have to take an official position on it, and they don’t. But I would like to see all of the various denominations of Christianity at least put the forensics out there in everybody’s face. Well, I’d Love to see the DNA. I’d like to, I’d like to see DNA if. Go. You know, if they’ve got the blood samples and they can ascertain, saying it’s ab. Ab. Right. Let’s, let’s, let’s put it under. Well, we got to get this thing opened up again. Not likely to happen under, under this Pope who’s a communist, but we’ll see what this goes.

There is. It is bubbling up now, a kind of a movement, the beginnings of pressure to open this up again to a new type of stir with today’s modern voice. Right. And I’m confident because if you look at it historically, every time there’s a technological advancement, the proofs always go in favor of the shroud. It starts with Sigil and Opio’s primitive camera. 33 years later, we got better camera. Then we got stirred, then we got the spec. Spectrometric analysis in the blood, etc. It just seems the more technology and science you throw at this thing, the more God’s just.

It seems like he’s sitting back saying, yep, shaking his head. You ain’t got nothing. Right. You know, I, I, you know, you really ought to reach out to Lee Strobel. I mean that sincerely. Yeah. Because again, he was, he was. His story was, is that he, his wife became a Christian, and he, he wrote the legal column for, you know, going through and looking all the, all the legal stuff, and he was gonna, he was just, he was a research guy, and he literally wrote a. He’s written a couple of books. One of them is called the Case for a Creator, A Case for Christ, and there’s several other.

But, but he all. It’s, it’s all case for. Because I think he was at one time an attorney or a lawyer, which is why he was qualified to write that column. And I mean, he’s a very devout Christian now, but he might be an advocate for, for getting this, because he’s not, you know, he’s not denominational or anything like that, but it would. He might be somebody that could, you know, maybe. Maybe push that a little bit. So. Yeah, anyway, I, I’m not not saying that you want to be a part of that or if that’s even an endeavor you want to, you want to go down, but, you know, you’ve taken the time to write this book.

It might, it might be worth just an, you know, even an email. So, so. But anyway, fantastic. This is definitely something I’m excited about promoting, and it’s off to a great start. On Amazon. And I’m excited about that because, you know, it’s a change of pace for me, but. And yet, in many ways, I. I think this is more powerful on people’s hearts and minds than I’m actually. The other stuff I write. I’m actually going to take the copy that I just got and. And I’m gonna go give it to my mom because, you know, she.

And. And let her read it, and I’m. And I’m gonna get a copy and I’m gonna send it to another. I’m gonna get. Actually, I’m gonna get a couple. Couple color. Couple of copies and send them out to. To. To some friends. It’s something you can feel good about giving out. Yeah. Because believe me, ain’t nobody gonna come back to you and say, oh, this is wrong, wrong, wrong. Right. Just dealing in forensics here. Okay. If they want to make a different conclusion, that’s fine. Nothing. Make sure. Fix your typos. Oh, no, I had him in the presentation, not in the book, though.

Oh, okay. Okay, Okay. I transpose. I transposed the number 1350-1530, the shroud. And you missed number seven. Yeah, I saw that. Yeah. But otherwise, you know, but I mean, I’m being. I’m clearly. I’m being. Having fun and being nitpicky, but. But fantastic job. This was. This was a welcome. It was a very, very good change of pace. So very good job, sir. Okay. Thank you. Alrighty. Well, enjoy your evening, sir. And I’m glad you still have a house over your head in the middle of winter. That was a little scary. Yeah. But thanks again, Mike, and enjoy your weekend, and we’ll see you next Tuesday.

Okay, thank you. Take care. All right, good night.
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